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Author Topic: Is defensive play viable now in V6?  (Read 11054 times)
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Piackage
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« on: October 07, 2013, 04:35:16 AM »

What does everyone think so far? Is defensive play possible in V6? It certainly was not in the previous version, but here it seems more balanced. I think the addition of the Curtain Wall makes it so. At least early on, it seems to be very effective. I suspect, as with the old version, as we begin to see Elite units and larger armies emerging, defense will no longer be possible. But its a shame, because that is a style that many players wish to utilize.
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congueror
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« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2013, 11:22:54 AM »

hello
want a game without time limit *bravo*
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antalj
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« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2013, 05:49:19 AM »

After getting some attacks I can say that, every kind of defense is useless
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fumigen
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« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2014, 18:57:28 PM »

Nice
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Muwe
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« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2014, 19:02:28 PM »

Both aggressive and defensive strategies are worth it, if you know how to use them. Loosing 2-3 attacks, does not mean that defense is not working.. just means that you are in need of improving your defensive skills.. look at what armies your opponents mostly use to attack you, look at the description of that unit, and build the anti-unit. As simple as that.. Golden rule, both here and in version 5, is balance.. you need to try and keep a balance between your economical strength and your army strength.. a huge army does not mean you will be invincible. Just means you will be able to move it harder (eats more gold).
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Valar morghulis !
juan74888
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« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2014, 22:32:03 PM »

That is truth I think you are right thanks for the coment. *Smiley*
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RCrashR
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« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2014, 17:35:26 PM »

v6 is very different than v5
I think that the defense strategies are not viable anymore in v6. They need to change some params in fortresses and defense facilities because now you can just destroy any kind of fort with ease.
In v6 best defense is the offense.
And I think and hope they will make the fortresses and defense facilities more powerful because f7, f8 and f9 are crap at the moment, experienced players destroy them with ease and with minimum loses. And also people now build those fortresses just for economical purposes and not defense.
Also f9 is build only to garrison your army so it won't eat that much.
So dear developers please make the defensive facilities be used for their defensive attributes and not economical ones.
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RomanticGR
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« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2014, 11:52:05 AM »

To play Defence in version 6 means to combine defense with strong economy and balanced defensive army. you can easily play defense tactic in version 6 but the game style will be transformed for you to pure development
raise of economy and defenses. this game style will be usefull for alliance later because a strong economy of the player is always a good way to assist your alliance.
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Milty
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« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2014, 12:35:05 PM »

What does everyone think so far? Is defensive play possible in V6? It certainly was not in the previous version, but here it seems more balanced. I think the addition of the Curtain Wall makes it so. At least early on, it seems to be very effective. I suspect, as with the old version, as we begin to see Elite units and larger armies emerging, defense will no longer be possible. But its a shame, because that is a style that many players wish to utilize.
+1

At high level, defense is useless. Need change it in next version.
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Muwe
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« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2014, 12:38:41 PM »

Milty,

20 minutes ago you stated that you play for a week. I`m sorry to see that you made such a rushed decision and consider that defensive playing is useless. Just because someone can defeat you, while you are trying to defend, due to your lack of experience, does not make the style of play useless.
Please read the manual, play with the simulator, and you will find defensive playing a lot more helpful then you think.

All the best.
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Valar morghulis !
deathruin
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« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2014, 16:03:36 PM »

Defensive is not completely out of the question, but it's difficult for the following reasons:
1. Fortress upgrades(and everything along with it) generates way too much points. Unless you are in the leader pack such that no player higher than 2x range exists, this means you are now open to attack from stronger players which makes the defense moot. At the same time, it makes your own attacks more difficult. The solution? Make the fortress "special" in that its point increase is smaller than other types of resource expenditure. Quite frankly, fortress upgrade doesn't really make you all that much more threatening. In the very least do this for non-capitol provinces as currently upgrading fortress fully in all province generate a hell lot of points.

2. Pillage, especially in wars where there is no penalty, are not well protected against. The Sanctuary are simply insufficient. Along with point #1, that it opens you to bigger attacks, defense facilities are not really helping the cause. Solution? Allow fortress garrison to attack the enemy army with reduced efficiency during the field assault phase and inflict some further damage during pillage. Realistically, if there is a castle in my town and I'm forced to fight in the field because we can't all go in, I'm gonna fight with my back to the wall so the ballistas on them towers will help me shoot the enemy.

3. The fact the boxed province bonus diminishes with time. The fact is, the length of the battle, assuming a "full" force is sent doesn't significantly increase over time(castle level is canceled by higher attack limit, fortification by slightly higher attack limit curve, higher unit tier and attack research). Which means the amount of moral it takes to sack a fortress with a full army stays about the same. But the amount of a morale a player can get, as time passes, increases, both with honor that accumulate slowly, army drill research and special resources one can capture(up to +89) while boxed province stay at -20. At early stage of the game, this is very significant and is the leading cause of many siege losses, but later on, not so much. I therefore propose to have it either changed to a % value(such as -15%) or allow double/triple boxed province. Specifically: if it's surrounded by 8 provinces, it is double boxed, if the 4 adjacent provinces are all walled provinces, it is triple boxed. Note that triple does imply double, as it would require the 4 corner provinces in order for the 4 adjacent to become boxed themselves. Furthermore, this is only realistic in later game as it takes 8 province minimal for double and for an early double box, it means no other provinces can be boxed themselves. There could also be a quad-box that requires all 20 provinces, meaning 4 adjacent double boxed(this, in fact, is equivalent to 8 surrounding boxed). The exact amount for each "tier" of boxed can be discussed, but 20/30/40 or 15/25/35/45 sounds good to me. Note that max morale is alliance+10, resource +10, drill +15, honor+20, so even -45 would mean up to 110 for the attacker still. And if he have attacker skill/talent or is emperor/successor, it can be up to 30(34?) higher for 140(144?)! I think that should be enough so this modification would not be devastating. (On that note, the guide says the max talent effect is half of the max skill effect, but I got a girl with +8 on her attacker talent and another with +20% on her bureaucracy, shouldn't those values be impossible?)
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manoleee
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« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2014, 02:32:23 AM »

muie labaaaaaaaaaa
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TheGreenOne
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« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2016, 03:33:19 AM »

After trebuchets are out, with BC and the global events most players gets over 1500 trebuchets, 1500 rams and that makes useless any f9, regardess of the general or courtain wall.

In early and mid game u can play defensive with a castle, but for later stages u can only play defensive with a good defensive field army, castle is useless. It helps if u get counter high enough that the enemy can not know ur army composition or size.

Would be nice to get the option of higher castles (maybe 10?), at least for the capital
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