Javelin men

[nekodrugi]

At this early stage what is use of Javelin men?

Can anybody give me one realistic scenario why should i build them. Some strategy that i oversight.

Field battles are rare, pillages too and in direct army VS army fight they would die like flies.

Given that experienced players already have somewhat balanced army i just don't see any use of them.

Imperials archers kills them with no trouble, Nomads archers too, Cavalry Archers have advantage and finally javelin  die in the blink of the eye in fort siege.

Why should i spend resources and ruin my population building them since i guess only in MASS numbers they are any good.

Even against pillage they are no good if Nomad is coming with cavalry archers.

And when i'm already writing in strategy section i would ask one more thing. In "old" realms you wanted to push as much as possible paladins in flanks. Now i don't see that this advantage exists (50% stronger attack).

I'm I correct?

[steveempire]

Honor, speed and defense.

1) anything that dies creates honor...honor makes it possible to defeat large armies or high level forts without fear of going below 50 morale
2) they go 1.5 speed man!  You can pillage and be home 2X before the slow army with siege makes it home... think about where you can use the speed
3) To be thorough, although I cannot find it in the new manual, this was true in V4 as you know, in defense, all yuo want to do is stay alive until the enemy dies or runs.  The javalin men spread more horse to wings for flank attack.  In flank attack, horse attack with 1.5X attack.  It is harder to kill an army with all horse on wings, than army with many horse in the center...especially if you have a mix of light and medium and elite horse.  Lights fill wings before elite horse.

Honor is the difference between small time bully and creating a "death star" account which can reach out past even 3X for a kill.

[nekodrugi]

Honor, speed and defense.

1) anything that dies creates honor...honor makes it possible to defeat large armies or high level forts without fear of going below 50 morale
2) they go 1.5 speed man!  You can pillage and be home 2X before the slow army with siege makes it home... think about where you can use the speed
3) To be thorough, although I cannot find it in the new manual, this was true in V4 as you know, in defense, all yuo want to do is stay alive until the enemy dies or runs.  The javalin men spread more horse to wings for flank attack.  In flank attack, horse attack with 1.5X attack.  It is harder to kill an army with all horse on wings, than army with many horse in the center...especially if you have a mix of light and medium and elite horse.  Lights fill wings before elite horse.

Honor is the difference between small time bully and creating a "death star" account which can reach out past even 3X for a kill.

He he he. I know all those things but they work in V4a. In my current v4a era i have almost 3000 moral so trust me i understand fight logic.

But mind you i wrote "at this early stage". Very soon we would get into heavy units and than into elite. Not much fight is done till people research elite.

By the way i never EVER pillage with spears. Small pack of archers would blow them away and almost always people keep some extra archers in forts. If you ask me pillage with spears is suicide (unless some extreme noob attack you)

Since V5 have extra unit for nomads that eliminate any advantage javelin could have i wonder what's the meaning of building them. Also i couldn't read anywhere if javalins would spread cavalry to wings.

I don't know if there is attack bonus for cavalry going on wings etc etc.

[steveempire]

It is always good to think and ask questions... if nothing else, you make the manual better. 200000 spears can be used to pillage 4 provinces and of course you send along other units, like horse to protect them.  Pillaging 4 provinces sends stronger message than pillaging 1.  I sometimes send siege units with my spears to kill non-boxed forts, as long as they live long enough to breach, everything is usually ok.  Dead spears just mean more honor...but it sounds like you know that already. 
In version 4a, spears are great for carry siege and carry goods back, so you can have a main army plus useful special forces.  I have never understood players who seem to focus on 1 main army and do everything with it.  You can see it in their attack history.  1 attack every 3 or 4 hours.  My attack record shows full attacks to match military academy level. 
well thats me.  I am interested to see what the answer is too. 

[redborg]

the answer is defence from horsmen

[nekodrugi]

the answer is defence from horsmen

Ehh that's what confuse me.

YES in old realm. In new realm you send cavalry archers and you can say goodbye to your spears.

[redborg]

this rather assumes a nomad is attacking.

perhaps you are attacking an imperian and thats why you need them.

[nekodrugi]

this rather assumes a nomad is attacking.

perhaps you are attacking an imperian and thats why you need them.

Imperian have VERY strong archers. They kill swords with no trouble so chances of spears surviving are slim at best

[redborg]

yes but thats always been the case.

but phlanx were still the strongest unit in v4a

[nekodrugi]

yes but thats always been the case.

but phlanx were still the strongest unit in v4a

 

Well not a strongest but largest in numbers --- hell yes.

[HerrSchultze]

exactly spears is al about : move cav to flank cheaply, and making the enemy cav die faster than yours, in the end the player with more cav at the end of the battle wins, so it could give some cheap advantage vs huge cav (same as swords do, but 1/2 cheaper ) also you used to move villagers from one prov to another, and that kind of things.
archers were really weak too, but ofc it is the unit for forts, offensively they are used in large numbers to stretch morale on fort siege and destroying advantage given by spears starbucks's wisdom to you guys

[mimacor]

Bueno Amigo las jabalinas. te ayudan a el hornor. entre mas tengas mas Honor ganas. Ellas tienen un ataque x3 Mayor a los pesados. por lo tanto te dan mas honor en las batallas saludos